Toyota: Williams F1 & Jarno Trulli out?
August 23, 2009 by Negative Camber
Filed under Prime & Option, Top Story
Toyota announced to day that there is a likelihood that they will not close negotiation gaps with current driver Jarno Trulli. Trulli, a 5-year veteran of the team, says that cash is not an issue but the team is looking for cost-cutting opportunities. What do you think? Good move? Bad move?
Team boss John Howett told Reuters:
“We are in negotiation (with Trulli) and we haven’t reached an agreement and there is a possibility that we won’t close the gap,” he told Reuters after qualifying for Sunday’s European Grand Prix.
“At the moment the gap is reasonably large,” added Howett. “We have to say there is a very strong probability not (to renew).”
In other news, Williams F1 is seeking to end their engine supply agreement with Toyota for the 2010 season. Sir Frank Williams, team owner, told Autosport that the decision would be made soon:
“It will be quite soon,” he said. “We have got to find a way to put it into a car, haven’t we?”
“The paddock is full of gossip,” he said when asked if Renault was his preferred option. “Tomorrow it might be Mercedes-Benz, and then the next day Ferrari – and I get a free car with it!”
The response from Toyota’s John Howett was one of caution and perhaps insight:
“It is a slightly complex situation,” team president John Howett told AUTOSPORT. “The original document we gave the right for Williams to seek an alternative engine. The basis was that should they get a free engine in the future, perhaps from a new entrant manufacturer, then we would not be there to damage Williams in any way with purely contractual relations.
“Earlier this year they pushed us to sign an extension agreement covering specifically next year, which we have concluded, but they are asking, or seeking, to find an alternative supplier.
“Toyota’s position is normally flexible. If they do not wish to take our engine, I don’t really feel materially, provided we can reduce the stock and are not left with any liability, that we hold them to the contract.”
Let’s consider that Howett is correct and perhaps Renault is providing a lump (engine) for free. That makes the decision relatively straightforward considering that the Renault engine has done well by Red Bull (save versus this weekends failure in Sebastian Vettel’s car) and there is no question the price is right.
On the other hand, I can’t shake the feeling that Williams could be seriously considering the Cosworth options as well. If it came down to Renault for free or Cosworth for $5MM; I’d take the Renault. Because who wouldn’t want the opportunity to work with the Flav?
If Nico Rosberg leaves Williams F1 for McLaren or any other team and they part company with Toyota as an engine supplier; we might have two new drivers in a Williams next year. If Sir Frank’s word about Nick Heidfeld were not just smoke and mirrors, perhaps the German could find another home at Williams again?
Also, Timo Glock could stay at Toyota as they have an option on him. This, I think, is a good idea. I think Glock is unproven in a larger sense and proven in a work-a-day sense. He has shown spirit, determination and grit. If Toyota were looking for inexpensive driver, perhaps Kaz Nakajima would fit the bill seeing as a Williams F1 without Toyota lumps would have little reason to field a Japanese driver.
as much as i like trulli, it might be time for fresh legs at toyota. someone with a different enough style who may be able to do something else with the car he’s given. as for glock, he may have something yet to be shown, but he’s gonna need a better car or team to show it. such a frustrating story for toyota.
At this point they’ve spent well near $2.5bln on F1 in less than 8 years, with nothing to show for it, why get cheap with a driver’s salary? I wonder what direction they’re interested in moving with a driver though… Is Heidfeld or Kubica a better bet than Trulli? Could they be looking for a true younger project like Sutil?
Moving forward, if I were Williams, while the Renault engine has been very reliable, so has the Toyota. There have not been many mechanical or hydraulic failures I can remember over the past year and a half. And yes, the Renault engine has helped the Red Bull cars, but look at the gap in the chassis between the Red Bull and the Renault. Its just, that I know what I have in the Toyota and I’m not sure thats anything less than I would be getting with the car I currently have by putting a Renault lump in it.
Cosworth is an interesting gamble. Either they are going to be the Cosworth of old, reliable, down on power, and not having the resources to catch-up, so they offer in exchange for technical help free engines to Williams… or since this will be the first V8 engine they’ve designed, I wonder if they have had a chance to dramatically improve over the loosely homologated versions of the V8′s that the current suppliers already have, and may at least short term have closed that gap or even have a better engine as far as the power curve and drive-ability… and need Williams to be a proven, marginally successful current team, to be a selling point to say “look what our engines are capable of!”
Cosworth have never designed a V8? Never heard of the Cosworth DFV? The most successful engine in the history of F1. I think the Williams may be the best car at the moment, it’s just seriously down on power, the Toyota engine is rubbish.
Suffice to say you are correct, the DFV was a stellar lump. Cosworth, however, will have new challenge in making a V8 that runs at 18,000 revs and produces 850 bhp. The DFV was incredible and hopefully their new entry will be equally incredible.
The rev-limit rule makes Cosworth’s entry far easier – they have a history of producing very drivable engines, their last V10 was a nice engine until Ford took over development and ruined it. Cosworth could not compete with the big-budget Mercedes backed Ilmors or Ferrari, both using exotic materials for rev-ceiling advantages which Cosworth could not afford. The RPM cap is what turned the excellent Honda engine into an also-ran last year, Honda had a top-end rev (therefore power) advantage (probably due to expertise on bike engines) this advantage has been quashed by the technical regs and I suspect was a key reason for Honda’s withdrawal from F1. 18,000 rpm is not a problem for a 2.4 litre V8 and can be achieved without exotic materials, it was harder to make a V10 rev that high due to harmonic vibration issues breaking things. Look at the stunning reliability of today’s engines they are operating well within what’s technically possible – the rev ceiling has made F1 engine development much cheaper.
Given the restriction of the current engine regs and standard issue ECUs I’d put my money on Cosworth to produce an engine matching anything in the field in terms of power and drivability. If Williams gets a free Cossie lump and retains Rosberg or gets another top driver – I’ll be heading down the bookies for a bet.
I think you may have sussed it out, Becket. I can’t really see any other reason for dumping Toyota. There is no reason why Renault, or any other major engine manufacturer would give away engines for free, but Cossy could stand to benefit from the experience of a mid-field team.
As for Trulli, if the gap isn’t money, as he says, what would it be? Toyota is one team that probably should be trying to land a top driver, but they have shown in the past that they don’t really understand that area of strategy. They fired Salo and McNish and later hired Ralph. Doh!
My guess is that Williams is certain to lose Rosberg and plan to replace him with Hulkenberg (Nico for Nico!). They don’t want to pair a rookie with Kaz because that’s kind of a weak lineup going into next season.
Then there’s KERS which it appears that Williams might use next year. Perhaps a different power unit will perform better with their flywheel KERS. I remember one of the reasons Adrian Newey at Red Bull wanted the Renault engine was because of it’s relatively lower cooling requirements. So perhaps Williams are aiming to pair the Renault engine with their own KERS system.
Finally, Williams has definitely got a handle one the current aero regulations. A couple more steps and they will actually be contending for race wins. The final equation is that the team must be thinking big for 2010. They’ll bring in the new Nico and then go for a top driver, who’s not quite at the elite level–perhaps someone like Kubica.
If I was a betting man, Kubica will end up at Reneault. Flav screwed up one with him and cut him loos and has stated it was a mistake.
That might be a good bet. And it would be a good move for Renault.
Williams-Renault. An awesome combination in the nineties and possibly again in 2010.
I suppose that’s Nakajima out of a drive?
Yes, please … new lead driver at Toyota. I think Glock can drive the wheels off, he just doesn’t have the experience to make iron-clad suggestions to improve the car. I remember Schumi and Trulli were always upset because they both wanted the cars tuned so dramatically different. They’d set it up for Trulli, and Schumi complained it was on the knife edge of control at the limit. Spend some budget on a guy that can help develop the car. IMO, I think Toyota has just slowly fallen off the pace and their updates haven’t been big enough leaps forward, ie McLaren the last 3 or so races. Seems that the Toyota is hard to drive on the edge because both the handling is very unforgiving and engine are very peaky. I would have thought with Valencia being a faily aero-based track that they would have done better.
Heildfeld/Hulkenberg in the Williams Cosworth
Kubica/ Glock in the Toyota till they announce that they are pulling out of F1 and looking for a buyer
Here’s my take… Trulli is reckless, if you count the damage to cars in the past 3 years you get: numerous broken wings, crashed cars all over the place, miserable performance, hardly any feedback (they love Glock – he likes Germans – actually goes, alone, to the factory – Trulli goes when they ‘send him a plane ticket” and then hates Germany (he gave an interview in Berliner Morganpost 3 years ago saying he hated coming to Germany, haha, it wasn’t sunny)..
ANYTHING they can do to get rid of him, they should.
Get Kubica!
Kubica would be a very good choice. If not Nico. If they can’t get either, I would seriously put Nick in the seat or get some of Le Seb’s sponsor money. If Williams dump Toyota and KAz, look for the Japanese driver to woo Toyota. If Ferrari are parting ways with Kimi; there is always that opportunity.
If they dont like Trulli’s negative attitude, would they really want to replace him with a balding, younger version of the same negative personality?